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'We’re talking about human lives': Judge urges lawyers to compromise on St. Louis County mask mandate

Lawyers said they've had several conversations but haven't been able to come to an agreement. The judge plans to make a decision Thursday if no resolution is made

ST. LOUIS COUNTY, Mo. — A St. Louis County circuit judge extended a temporary restraining order until Thursday on the county's mask mandate with one condition.

She asked for both sides to work together to come up with a possible resolution.

On Tuesday, Judge Nellie Ribaudo gave the attorneys 24 hours to discuss possible outcomes. Wednesday morning, she asked if they talked about the matter at hand and created a possible compromise. 

The answer: No resolution.

John Sauer is the plaintiff's lawyer representing Attorney General Eric Schmitt, who filed a lawsuit last month to stop the mask mandate in St. Louis County. He said both sides tried to come up with a solution.

"The parties worked hard to do so, we had telephone conversations with proposals after the hearing. But we are not in agreement," Sauer said.

Judge Ribaudo pushed the idea, hoping additional time would lead to an agreement. 

Neal Perryman is the defendant's attorney representing St. Louis County Executive Dr. Sam Page.

"We are far apart since there is a disagreement on legal principles. I am not optimistic that there will be a meaningful compromise, but who knows. I think we’re at a point of impasse in rounds of discussions," Perryman responded. 

The judge countered, offering a possible resolution.

"You don’t think parties can come to terms that a strongly worded recommendation that people should wear masks due to the numbers, that’s not something you can agree to? For the good of the people, for a mandate that isn’t really a mandate merely a rec?" Ribaudo asked.

Perryman said enforcement is difficult, but with the data at hand, mandates are more effective. 

"We discussed a lot in the last 24 hours, we have some hours today. We can talk to be optimistic; I am not optimistic," Perryman explained.

Judge Ribaudo pressed both sides to continue working it out.

"People are getting sick, hospitalized at record numbers and dying. If both sides could work together for a solution to educate people on benefits of wearing masks coming from the two largest departments the state has, I think, to me, it’s beneficial because at this point, we’ve got people that don’t think it’s real," the judge firmly added. "We keep letting politics dictate decision making. What a statement it would make to the people if y’all come up with a way to protect them, wouldn’t that be a political benefit for everyone involved as well as the public health?"

Perryman understood the judge's concern but said it would be difficult to go backwards and adding, "We don’t how to bridge that gap."

"I believe in the people in the state and to protect their personal health. I believe that people that lead them can come up with a resolution," Judge Ribaudo continued. "I think it’s important for the people in our state to know what our leaders are doing to protect themselves and others from this virus. We’re talking about human lives, you can’t tell me that’s not worthy of further conversation."

After Wednesday's hearing, both sides agreed they can talk and are committed to working together before the temporary restraining order expires Thursday.

The judge requested both sides to meet again at 11 a.m. Thursday. 

She said this gives her enough time to make a decision, in case a resolution is not met.

BACKGROUND

On Aug. 3, St. Louis County circuit court granted a temporary restraining order, which halted the mask mandate placed by the St. Louis County Department of Public Health and St. Louis County Executive Dr. Sam Page. 

The mask mandate in St. Louis County went into effect on July 26 and Attorney General Eric Schmitt filed a lawsuit that same day to stop the reinstatement of a mask mandate.

The mandate was repealed on July 27, after a vote from the St. Louis County Council.

WEIGHING IN

To give some perspective, 5 On Your Side spoke to John Ammann, a SLU law professor.

Ammann explains it's common for judges to ask the parties to try and work out a settlement. 

"Judges know that this kind of case will have better compliance with any kind of court order, if it was reached by agreement. The judge is telling them 'I don't care about the politics, either work this out or I will'. The benefit of the parties trying to work out something together is that neither side will lose totally," Ammann adds.

Ammann further explains the judge has several options here.

"The least favorite for her would be to write the decision by herself with no agreement and just say this is the order of the court, she will do that. She's a tough, but fair judge, she will do that. But again, it will only be based on the circumstances in front of her this week," he says. 

Ammann tells 5 On Your Side,"I think any resolution we might get from the court by agreement or by the judge this week, will be something that will be reviewed fairly quickly in the weeks to come, just because the circumstances are going to change," he adds. 

Whatever decision is made, it's something that could impact the rest of the state.

"The judge is in a very difficult situation. It's a once in a 100-year pandemic and it's a once in a 100-year lawsuit. If the judge enters a decision that's not by agreement of the parties, it will carry weight in other parts of Missouri. For Missouri, you can bet other local governments, school districts included, will be reading Judge Ribaudo's decision very carefully," Ammann says.

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