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Gabe Gore: 'Wealth should play no role' in pre-trial detention

St. Louis Circuit Attorney Gabe Gore discussed his views on the criminal justice system on 'The Record' a day before launching his bid for a full four-year term.

ST. LOUIS, Missouri — St. Louis Circuit Attorney Gabe Gore made it official on Wednesday: He's running. 

Gore will seek a full, four-year term next November after Gov. Mike Parson (R-Missouri) appointed him to fill the vacancy left by Kim Gardner earlier in 2023. 

Gore, who resigned from his post at the high-powered law firm Dowd Bennett, delivered a 'Six-Month Report' to show progress in filing charges and closing cases at a faster clip. But how would he approach a campaign for office? And what pledges might he make to voters as he seeks their support?

Gore sat down with 5 On Your Side Political Editor Mark Maxwell for an interview on Tuesday (the day before he publicly declared his candidacy) to discuss his views of the criminal justice system. 

Below is a complete, unedited transcript of the extended interview: 

Maxwell: Saint Louis Circuit Attorney Gabe Gore is now on The Record, and it's good to have you with us.  

Gore: It's good to be here. 

Maxwell: You also said that your office is now charging cases when they're applied for. That implies renewed or increased trust in police. How automatic is that decision when you file those charges?  

GoreWell, when I say that we're filing charges when they're applied on, it doesn't mean that we're not conducting a review process and determining that there's enough evidence to support the charges. So I don't think it reflects necessarily an increased trust in police. What it reflects is a timely process of conducting the analysis necessary to make a charging decision.  

Maxwell: And perhaps that contrast was important to raise because you also mentioned that... You highlighted your predecessor's lax discretion on pursuing property crimes in particular. You said that there would be a change in the way business was conducted, that property crimes wouldn't just be left uncharged. How would you describe that policy's impact to the city's economy or overall morale? 

Gore: So I wasn't necessarily referencing the prior administration's approach. What I was referencing was that's what we were pursuing; and therefore, I think that that is the basis for the increased number of charges.  

Maxwell: Well, you said it was a decision and that the office would no longer be letting crimes go uncharged. That sounds like a discretion decision.  

Gore: For me, it wasn't really a discretionary decision. As circuit attorney, it's my job to enforce the laws. So it wasn't something where I felt like I was exercising discretion. I feel like I was just doing my job.  

Maxwell: Mm-hmm. Enforcing the laws that are on the books.  

Gore: Exactly. 

Maxwell: You mentioned that you're still weighing this question of whether to be a political candidate. That was the part of it that you highlighted. You said you like the work, but being a political candidate... It sounded like you might have been saying that prospective candidates may flinch or pause at the notion of subjecting themselves to weathering that storm of scrutiny or spin or smears that rival candidates might throw at you. Was that the part of it that gives you pause?  

Gore: I would say that it is, I think, a common perception today among most people that being involved in politics is a tough business and something that most people aren't looking to subject themselves to. I would count myself among those people. I was not someone looking to be a political candidate. I took this job on because I welcome the opportunity to serve. Not that I necessarily welcomed the opportunity to become a political candidate. So that's the analysis that I'm conducting, whether I'm willing to take on that necessary task of running for office in order to continue this work that I'm really enjoying and to continue to service that I've embarked on.  

Maxwell: You're a professional who brings indictments. That's something of an indictment of our political system. I think perhaps the incentive structure is off somewhat in how we vet and recruit candidates for high office. 

Gore: I haven't given it that much thought. I was really just thinking about it from my perspective.  

Maxwell: Sure. As one does. Do you see yourself as a reformer or an executor of the criminal justice system that we have today?  

Gore: I view myself, in my role as circuit attorney, as someone who the community has placed a tremendous amount of trust in. That is a tremendous responsibility: being circuit attorney and enforcing the laws.  

Maxwell: With respect, the community hasn't yet. The governor has. The community may still do that.  

Gore: I like to think that the community has and we've been completely embraced by the community. So I would disagree with you on that. I think the community has placed that trust in our office. I think that's been reflected in my engagement with the community. And I welcome that. And my goal is to perform my duties professionally, competently, with fairness and compassion.  

Maxwell: Do you see avenues through which your office can affect change, policy change, as a prosecutor? Or do you see that job as something left to the legislature?  

Gore: I believe that the approach we take to enforcing the laws is policy. I think that's when I say that there's a tremendous trust placed in the office. I think the charging decisions we make are policy. I think the manner in which we dispose of cases in terms of making recommendations for plea negotiations, which are a necessary part of any prosecutor's office, that's policy. I think setting up a diversion unit and determining how your diversion unit is going to operate, that's policy. I think making the decision that I've made that I'm going to deeply engage with the community, that I'm going to be available, that I'm going to be out there in community meetings, that that's policy. So, yes, we have an impact on policy.  

Maxwell: And I think the public often grades a candidate at what they want to do, what they want to achieve in office. And it's sometimes harder to grade a candidate at how good they are at achieving it. So that's kind of the tension between governing and running for office that I'm trying to explore here a little bit in learning how you think about this office. Let's get into some specifics beyond just the way you see the office, but the practical impact.  

Maxwell: You've got a lot of defendants locked up in the city justice center right now. Have you been inside?  

Gore: I have not. 

Maxwell: Would you like to see the conditions there? How would you describe what you've heard so far?  

Gore: I've been inside of a lot of jails and prisons during the course of my career. I've spent more times in jails and prisons than most people. And I will, at some point, go over into her and get a sense of of what's going on there. But, you know, it's... As circuit attorney, I don't run the jails. I don't have responsibility for the jails.  

Maxwell: Sure. You've been on the job six months now. I imagine you've seen hundreds, if not thousands of cases come across your desk. In the course of reviewing those charges, have there been any cases where a suspect accused of a violent felony has been able to post bond and avoid going to the city Justice Center while they wait for their trial?  

Gore: You're asking me whether there have been any cases during the time that I've been a circuit attorney where a defendant, someone charged by our office, has made bond? Yes. There's been many, many, many, many. 

Maxwell: Mm-hmm. Have there been any … Conversely, have there been any defendants accused of a nonviolent crime that couldn't pay bond, couldn't afford to post that payment and remain in jail?  

Gore: I do not. I am not in the weeds. We currently have, I believe, 3,000 felonies pending in the 22nd Judicial Circuit filed by my office. I am not in the weeds every day reviewing bond decisions and charging. That's not part of my role. 

Maxwell: I guess the question is what role should wealth play in determining a suspect's liberty before their trial, before their conviction?  

Gore: It is my view that -- And I believe this is largely what we see occur in the 22nd Judicial Circuit -- It is my view that wealth should play no role and that the decision that should be made is whether or not this is a defendant who can be released on bond with conditions in place that will assure -- ensure -- the safety of the community. That, to me, is the critical piece is that, one, you ensure that defendants are not going to pose a danger to the community; and, that they're going to show up for their court dates and participate in the prosecution of their case.  

Maxwell: So when the public hears you say wealth should play no role, do they also hear you say you'd like to see the legislature change that and abolish cash bail? Or do you still see that as a tool at your discretion?  

Gore: I am not a legislator. I'm not a legislator. I don't sit around thinking about what they should do in Jeff City. I focus on where the rubber meets the road, which is our courthouse. And that's the practice I see. That's the analysis I see our judges going through on a daily basis. 

Maxwell: Very interesting. You said in your six-month progress report that you hope to sit down with at least two committees at the Board of Aldermen to ask for some budget funding. What are some of the different things, practically speaking, that you still need to complete the important work of justice before you?  

Gore: You know, like I said: we need investment in our IT system. It was in complete disrepair. And in a state where one expert said to me they would not even refer to it as a system. We are currently in a situation where our investigators are spending 30% of their time manually downloading videos and body cams that are evidence in cases, whereas if we get an IT fix, they can free that time up and use that time focusing on investigating their case and working with witnesses. So investment in IT and investment in our people. 

I would like to see, you know, our lawyers did their work. Even though we've hired significantly, and we're getting assistance from neighboring prosecuting attorney's offices, the workload that our attorneys are under and our support staff is under is still tremendous. I would like to see that reflected in their compensation. I would like to see us compensated in a way that is competitive with neighboring prosecuting attorney's offices and city attorney's offices. 

And I also would like to see an investment in training and investment in our people. We have a... We're going to need a lot of young attorneys to step up and handle the most serious felonies earlier in their career than they typically would need to because of the loss of that experience in the prior administration. So we're going to require an increased investment in training, which we've already done as reflected in our hiring of the former Supreme Court Justice George Draper, to serve as our chief training officer, which is a position that has never before existed in the circuit attorney's office.  

Maxwell: Certainly in many in the court systems, have applauded that move. They've seen that as a positive step in the right direction. You mentioned IT as an internal -- it sounded like a software system or server that would house this data. But how crucial, how vital is it to also have police surveillance techniques like ShotSpotter, like the Real Time Crime Center, like that surveillance video? Do you need that? Do you need more of that to close cases?  

Gore: So those are resources that the police department has. I meet regularly with Chief Tracy. I was out with them yesterday at a violent crime reduction seminar. And I know he considers those valuable tools. I think he uses them effectively and I would like to see those methods continue. 

Mark Maxwell: Circuit Attorney Gabe Gore, thanks for joining us.  

Gore: Thank you. It was a pleasure to be here. 

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